SS: Mano laya: mind is absorbed through pranayama or any spiritual practice. It is absorbed in the support it takes. @GPji - deep sleep also is manolaya. Mind is absorbed in ignorance and becomes unmanifest. Even there, memory is functioning bec absence of everything is noted. This absorbed mind is like the bird trapped below the net. This was the verse 11 analogy.
Mano nasha: mind has two aspects - functional mind and psychological mind. Psychological mind is the sense of psychological identity we have which separates us from others. It has likes n dislikes, attachment n aversion etc. Functional mind has only functional thoughts, skills, knowledge etc. What binds us is the psychological mind. Basis of this is ignorance. Hence mano-nasha is avidya naasha only. Functional thoughts dont bind us at all. They will continue as long as body is there. Such a person is called Jivanmukta. If a jivanmukta's functional mind also dies then we would not have great masters at all and realisation would be a dangerous state which kills a person. 😳.
Merely absorption of mind is not the goal. Its only a means and a relief. The goal and cure is to destroy ignorance and psychological divisions.
@Nityamukta and Sanjit: mind does not die with death of the body. Subtle body consists of 5 senses of knowledge, 5 senses of action, 5 pranas, mind, intellect, memory n ego. All these depart from the gross body at death. Mind continues in subtler form till the next gross body is attained by karma.
If mind died with the death of the body, we would not have continuity of life n laws of action n results will be redundant. We also cant explain why so much variety in creation.
@Krishna- non-ignorant individual is jivanmukta. Ignorant is called Jeeva.
Mano nasha is realisation. Final state. Nothing more to achieve after that.
KG: Ok
GP: Beautiful swamiji! Thank you
KG: Swamiji the verse says,
Mano laya using restrain of Prana and Nasha using mind. So the restraint of Prana doesnt lead to the permanent state. Like u said temp relief. Is it then worthwhile to engage in it (Mano Laya). Is it just to show one the ecstasy
I mean glimpse the no mind like state....?
Su: Thank you so much Swamiji!!
SS: No its not to give a glimpse but to prepare the mind for the glimpse. The next verse answers this question.
Verse 14: This mind that gets absorbed by the restrain of the Pranas, gets destroyed by contemplation on that One (Reality)
Prana-bandhanaat leena-maanasam.
Eka-chintanaat naashametyadaha.
KG: Swamiji, this means the Contemplation on SELF will be fruitful (culminating in Mano Nasha) only when the preparation of the Sadhak has reached the level where he/she is able to Mano Laya in the spirit conveyed in here. This is Hatha Yoga way.
The converse may not be true. Karma and Bhakti yogins are not practicing control of Prana. Am I right?
SS: Karma and bhakti yogi's minds are absorbed in the ideal and in the Lord. Hence the process is same for all. Make the mind pure n calm. Then contemplate on Self.
KG: Ok. Thank you Swamiji!
SS: 8 steps of Ashtanga yoga or raja yoga are summarized by Ramana Maharshi in 2 steps.
Yama, niyama, asana, pranayama, pratyahara n dharana lead to mano laya.
Dhyan and samadhi lead to mano-nasha.
Yoga generally believes in only quietude of mind. Hence Ramana clarifies here that contemplation is very important. Else the mind which goes into samadhi will come back like the birds below the net.
MN: So Swamiji for a person who does only Raja Yoga or Ashtanga yoga is it possible for him also to reach the State of Realisation?
SS: Yes. If he contemplates on Self.
MN: So contemplation is the Key here...Just achieving quietude of mind will not serve the purpose...Thank you Swamiji for clarifying😊
SS: Yes
NB: Thanku Swamiji🙏
Mano nasha: mind has two aspects - functional mind and psychological mind. Psychological mind is the sense of psychological identity we have which separates us from others. It has likes n dislikes, attachment n aversion etc. Functional mind has only functional thoughts, skills, knowledge etc. What binds us is the psychological mind. Basis of this is ignorance. Hence mano-nasha is avidya naasha only. Functional thoughts dont bind us at all. They will continue as long as body is there. Such a person is called Jivanmukta. If a jivanmukta's functional mind also dies then we would not have great masters at all and realisation would be a dangerous state which kills a person. 😳.
Merely absorption of mind is not the goal. Its only a means and a relief. The goal and cure is to destroy ignorance and psychological divisions.
@Nityamukta and Sanjit: mind does not die with death of the body. Subtle body consists of 5 senses of knowledge, 5 senses of action, 5 pranas, mind, intellect, memory n ego. All these depart from the gross body at death. Mind continues in subtler form till the next gross body is attained by karma.
If mind died with the death of the body, we would not have continuity of life n laws of action n results will be redundant. We also cant explain why so much variety in creation.
@Krishna- non-ignorant individual is jivanmukta. Ignorant is called Jeeva.
Mano nasha is realisation. Final state. Nothing more to achieve after that.
KG: Ok
GP: Beautiful swamiji! Thank you
KG: Swamiji the verse says,
Mano laya using restrain of Prana and Nasha using mind. So the restraint of Prana doesnt lead to the permanent state. Like u said temp relief. Is it then worthwhile to engage in it (Mano Laya). Is it just to show one the ecstasy
I mean glimpse the no mind like state....?
Su: Thank you so much Swamiji!!
SS: No its not to give a glimpse but to prepare the mind for the glimpse. The next verse answers this question.
Verse 14: This mind that gets absorbed by the restrain of the Pranas, gets destroyed by contemplation on that One (Reality)
Prana-bandhanaat leena-maanasam.
Eka-chintanaat naashametyadaha.
KG: Swamiji, this means the Contemplation on SELF will be fruitful (culminating in Mano Nasha) only when the preparation of the Sadhak has reached the level where he/she is able to Mano Laya in the spirit conveyed in here. This is Hatha Yoga way.
The converse may not be true. Karma and Bhakti yogins are not practicing control of Prana. Am I right?
SS: Karma and bhakti yogi's minds are absorbed in the ideal and in the Lord. Hence the process is same for all. Make the mind pure n calm. Then contemplate on Self.
KG: Ok. Thank you Swamiji!
SS: 8 steps of Ashtanga yoga or raja yoga are summarized by Ramana Maharshi in 2 steps.
Yama, niyama, asana, pranayama, pratyahara n dharana lead to mano laya.
Dhyan and samadhi lead to mano-nasha.
Yoga generally believes in only quietude of mind. Hence Ramana clarifies here that contemplation is very important. Else the mind which goes into samadhi will come back like the birds below the net.
MN: So Swamiji for a person who does only Raja Yoga or Ashtanga yoga is it possible for him also to reach the State of Realisation?
SS: Yes. If he contemplates on Self.
MN: So contemplation is the Key here...Just achieving quietude of mind will not serve the purpose...Thank you Swamiji for clarifying😊
SS: Yes
NB: Thanku Swamiji🙏
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